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What do you think is the "best" Emu?
UOXC 10%  10%  [ 1 ]
UOX3 10%  10%  [ 1 ]
Sphere 20%  20%  [ 2 ]
POL 40%  40%  [ 4 ]
RunUO 20%  20%  [ 2 ]
LoneWolf 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
NOX 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Total votes : 10
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 Post subject: What is the "best" Emu.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2002 8:49 am 
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Journeyman
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With what happened on "Map Planning Takes Forever" (it turning into a emu fight) I was just wondering what everyone thinks about "their" emu.
I got the list of Emu's from http://www.smithysanvil.com/. Sorry but I couldn't fit all of them in there. So I'm just posting the main emu's that I've hear of.
Here is a list of the ones I couldn't post:
UOP
Legend
Tubi
Revelation
WolfPack
Epsilon

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2002 9:34 am 
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Actually, I thought the other thread was doing just fine. It's not a "war" yet :P and I'd stop it if it turned to one.

I think I'll have to refrain from voting, because I truely believe there is no "best" emu. But if the question was "What emu do you use mostly?" I'd have to say UOX .70x since that is bascially what I started with, and has the most options (for me) for creating maps. As in, the tools I use directly support wsc files.

Expanding on this, each emu has it's strong points and weak points. It's pretty much a matter of what you need. For me, this good/bad comparison is thus (in no particular order):
UOX .70x
Good: wsc files are easy to edit and the tools I use support it
Bad: Unable to get truely powerfuls scripts, and they break easy

UOX .9x
Good: JS added to the functionality of the scripts
Bad: Need to learn JS to use effectively and the community isn't exactly conductive to cooperation. (At least used to be)

UOXC
Good: Good for worldbuilding as wsc files are the norm
Bad: Slow release cycle and inherits weaknesses of UOX .70 (but getting better)

Sphere
Good: Best for large number of players. Stable with high activity
Bad: Closed source and support is scattered greatly

POL
Good: Incredibly powerful scripting system
Bad: Incredibly difficult scripting system to learn

RunUO
Good: Fast and stable, easiest to get started
Bad: Pretty much need to learn C# to effectively customize, and closed source.

Remember, this is my own personal opinions. This is only from my point of view, and of course (like everyone) I am preferential towards some than others.

-Ryandor


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2002 12:11 pm 
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Hehe, I gotta agree with Ryandor here. I voted for Sphere because well, it'd be treason if I didn't (being a sphere dev I should be at least a LITTLE loyal *grin*) but I also think that no one can say there is a 'best' emu. They've all got faults and bonuses.

Sphere I like best because I don't need a phd in computer science to use it. The scripting syntax (up until recently at least *grumble*) was pretty simple to catch on to in a matter of minutes/hours. It's very powerful if you know what you're doing with it, newer releases are even more so, but lost a good chunk of the user-friendliness. I love the fact there's a HUGE community, and help can be found 24 hours a day on just about anything. I love the fact that every program I could ever need is available for it and fairly easy to find. I hate the fact that bug fixes are at the mercy of just a couple devs, they have lives and can't work on it as fast as I'd love to. I hate the fact I can't program and help them with it :p I hate the fact that with a community the size of Sphere's, new bugs become a plague within minutes of being found, game-breaking exploits included, and aren't fixed nearly as fast.

UOX variants I like because they're familiar enough to be comfortable (Sphere grew up side-by-side with UOX, so they're actually fairly similar). Lonewolf/Wolfpack have proven themselves to be reliable, but the rate of progress on them and scripting options I didn't care for. Nox Wizard has an excellent community. I was very impressed with the dev responses on their forums. Wasn't real fond of the Small scripting though (of course, I don't know it). Revelation I haven't tried, the community never kicked it off big enough to check out for me, and several of the posts made it look like they'd re-merge into Nox so it didn't strike me as being a stable project.

UOX3 (0.9x versions that is) I like because the JS engine is very powerful and not so hard that I can't understand how to use it, even though it takes me awhile to script something that works lol. The JS engine is more powerful than Sphere's scripting language in many ways, but more limited in others. The devs are wonderful, I tried out the latest test build of 97.0.something or other for a few days, every bug I found in it & reported was fixed within a day or two, re-compiled, and re-released. I'm normally not big on small communities, but I think UOX3's current community is wonderful. They're all very eager to help each other and get things fixed ASAP. Drawbacks would be the few crashing bugs remaining in it, but they're working them out. It's just not stable enough, RIGHT NOW, for a live shard. Some of the scripting in it I can't stand, and some of the things not allowed in it strike me as basic needed features for any emu. Another drawback would be the lack of 3rd party tools that work with their new save formats. Having the .wsc files all broken up into regions makes all the tools useless.

POL is amazing, when done right. Unfortunately it takes a rocket scientist to do it right. The scripting allows you to completely redo pretty much everything in the game, if you know how. Hardcoded bugs in the core can be scripted over, so waiting on devs to fix bugs isn't needed. This turns away most new users though unfortunately, as fixing critical bugs in the server isn't a new admins main desire when learning a completely new system. My main gripe about POL would be the in-game feel. Remember me saying UOX felt 'comfy' like Sphere does? Well, POL feels alien. The only words to describe it (and I stole this description from someone else that feels the same way lol) is that POL feels like an emulator of an emulator.. or fake somehow. Not trying to be a diss against POL lol, it's just weird feeling in-game. Another gripe would be the tech support, or lack thereof. I went on POL's irc server with a problem. There were 3 people there that knew what they were doing. I politely said hello and asked my question in a mature/detailed manner (explaining what the problem was and what I'd already tried to do to fix it). The first person completely ignored me, he continued talking to someone else in there about girlfriends and such. The second person typed *shrugs* and went afk. The third person was afk when I asked, but came back shortly thereafter, answered in a quick "hurry up and get your answer and go away already" manner, and went afk again. I mean.. jeesh, that's not a very convincing way to get or keep users. The answer, btw, was in some foreign language called eScripting that no newbie should hope to comprehend *grin*.

I've only ran RunUO for a matter of a few minutes on the first or second beta release, so nothing was working then. It felt 'ok' in game. The politics involved with RunUO are a turnoff for me though. I will never use it, no matter how amazing it ends up, simply because of that. I can't say much of what I *do* like about RunUO considering I've not used it enough to know shit about it, I do like the idea of having an entire programming language at your disposal to script, I do not like the idea of having to learn a programming language just to script something simple. I like the fact that they're releasing beta after beta very quickly and are showing tons of progress in a short time, I do not like the fact that they WILL burn out at that rate and closed source projects with burned out devs (like Sphere was for over a year) are very bad things. I do not like other things, but again.. those are mainly flames and personal opinions :)

Epsilon started out amazing. The scripting language looked insanely promising, and so close to Sphere (as in, easy to use AND similar enough that I already understood it) that I was drooling all over the place. In game it felt comfy. It started out quick and progress was excellent, then it just.. fizzled. Kair burned out I guess, then tried a C# version of it instead of VB then stopped altogether. Seems he's working on it again though, so hopefully it'll shape up into an excellent emu over the next few months.


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 Post subject: .
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2002 2:41 pm 
Rosethorn, what do you do on the sphere dev team?


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2002 4:30 pm 
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I'm really not looking for the BEST emu. If you noted I did have it in quotes... meaning that there really isn't a best. I just wanted to know what people think.

I personaly like UOXC. Mainly because that's what I found ohhh so many years ago, and have just grown to like it.

I also like RunUO. Though for a GM/Admin it seems that there aren't that many commands (or maybe I'm just overlooking them, or just don't know what they are). For being in beta it seems really nice.

Then there are all the others that I really haven't given a shot at. Mainly because I like what I have and don't want to change. Not saying that any one is better then the other, not at all.

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 Post subject: .
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2002 4:35 pm 
"I" think UOXC is the best, but "I" can't be bothered by "you" to actually register and post.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2002 12:08 am 
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Galbuu, I do the scripts


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2002 1:05 am 
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I as well am not actually voting here.
Reason being that i have not tried many of them at all. I used UOX for a very (very) short time only to check out the world builder. (Uri's?) and it seemed ok, but i was not familiar enough with it to continue with it.
I started out with POL long ago alone, with no one to give any help with scripting. Managed to figure out a good bit with e-script enough to settle some bugs out. And yeah, there are many of them.
I got very discuraged with POL because of the dificulty with the language. I mean, you really have to go into great detail with that language.
We currently are making a full shard with RunUO as I am typing this right now. I will say though, we are not relying on the final release to base our shard on.
It goes like this atm, I do the Map/World making, statics work ets, and buildings.. My wife does the most of the Town building and that, and my good friend is scripting nearly everything he can while this goes on nearly 100% custom to our needs for this shard. ( my point coming up )

Basicly, my point being this.. RunUO -> Should the Devs burn out and stop all work right now, we feel that the core is stable enough, and with the C# language, that we could take over outside the core, and script what they have not done.
You see.. they are trying to make the core as light as possible. They know that peopls will want to customize the shards, the core gets smaller and smaller with each release.
At any rate, I do my world building with POL94 right now, as it is what i am use to, and a great emu for that (in my opinion) As for *.wsc files... We had discussed this today as well, and as i said in other post "Map Planning takes Forever" We have already a program for RunUO that uses the items.wsc file as well. It is almost fully finished. (works good, just working on simplicity now, like target location for export instead of exporting to the location the items are set in the .wsc file ) We made this for POL, and i use it every day..
Okay, i am going on here.. thats my summed up view
Hope you didnt fall asleep through it. :wink:

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2002 1:10 am 
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*Edit*
in reguards to the *.wsc section of my last post ->

Targeting location for Export locations without inputing the coords..
Targeting a location for Importing, for easy importing to any location. As it is on our POL shard..
sorry, I said it wrong up there ^_^

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 Post subject: .
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2002 5:40 am 
Do the scripts? Why can't they get someone that does the scripts AND programs? :wink:


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2002 7:24 am 
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umm, what do you thing Programing is?

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 Post subject: .
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2002 7:37 am 
Making scripts is not programming. I can make new monsters, items, and triggers in UOXC, that doesn't mean I program UOXC.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2002 7:52 am 
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Not your daddy
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well sure, but what do you think makes the core up? some special code that no one understands exept the devs

It is also scripts, only "locked" in the core :wink:

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2002 8:39 am 
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Why do they need someone that scripts AND programs? We have me for scripts and the programmers for the server. We get along well (when i'm not harrassing them to fix stuff *grin*) and we get stuff done.

Am I not good enough for you 8)


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2002 9:46 am 
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I don't do either. I just make pretty pictures (AKA maps).
I suck. :P

-Ryandor


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2002 4:02 pm 
RoseThorn wrote:
Why do they need someone that scripts AND programs? We have me for scripts and the programmers for the server. We get along well (when i'm not harrassing them to fix stuff *grin*) and we get stuff done.

Am I not good enough for you 8)


No, you aren't good enough.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2002 9:00 pm 
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I'm hurt that someone unable to use their name says I'm not good enough :roll:


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 Post subject: .
PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2002 8:13 am 
It was me, I just forgot to put in my name.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2002 9:45 am 
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You're always welcome to do better.


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 Post subject: .
PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2002 10:11 am 
Huh? What does that mean?


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2002 12:09 pm 
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uhh.. you really need that explained any better? Seems prety self explainatory to me :wink:

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 23, 2002 11:09 pm 
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Come on people I really don't want this turning into a fight. I just want to know what people think about the different Emu's.
So if you could.... Please don't fight.

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People ask me why I do this. Why I write such gross stuff. I tell them I have the heart of a small boy... and I keep it in a jar on my desk.
~Stephen King


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2002 3:19 pm 
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Forgot the "They all suck, UO is a boring game." option :-(

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2002 5:50 pm 
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Hmm... I can't say I've ever heard of that one befor...

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People ask me why I do this. Why I write such gross stuff. I tell them I have the heart of a small boy... and I keep it in a jar on my desk.
~Stephen King


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2002 7:11 am 
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a minus for RunUO, binary worldfile, since they use C#/Java style serialization, versioning problems when you revent script versions,
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Last edited by loupgarou on Fri Feb 25, 2011 8:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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